Tintype to Banjo Pipeline
In a new midweek episode, I’m joined by Artemis, a photographic artist from the UK. We met on a photo walk last year and have stayed in touch which is how I learned about their snail mail project. I wanted to share it with all of you since I’m really enjoying getting a lovely surprise every month in the post.
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Episode Transcript:
Iain:
we need nice projects for people to like do now more than ever um I think we need to come together in making things because the people in charge seem intent on breaking things and so absolutely yeah all we can do is focus on working together and making stuff and sharing things which is a
Artemis:
lovely way to say hello artemis how are you hello I am very well how are you yeah I'm really good um
Iain:
I'm really, really glad that we can sit down and talk to you. I just wanted to do like a little midweek one because you've been doing your snail mail project since the end of last year.
Artemis:
Yes, almost six months already, which is crazy. Is it really? Yeah. Whoa. The next issue will be six months, yeah.
Iain:
It feels like yesterday you were like photographing yourself next to a post box with the first ones, you know, going into the mail.
Artemis:
Yeah, it feels like that for me as well. I can't believe how quickly it's gone by.
Iain:
I think what's interesting, though, about the project, it's funny, you know, things happen. Lots of similar things often happen at the same time. It's like getting an ant's and a bug's life at the same time. And I've seen a few folks kind of it's been a trend for the last little while of like people want to get back to printing. I'm shooting film again and developing my own film and doing that sort of thing. Talk to me a little bit about the origin of this. Like where where where did it come from and what made you what compelled you to do it, I suppose?
Artemis:
I think like a lot of visual artists and photographers, especially, I was feeling really disillusioned with Instagram. The fact that, you know, you take a photo you're proud of, you want to share it. Hardly anyone sees it, you know, especially your followers don't even see it. It's just so much AI slop, people not paying attention, not very good reach. and I'd seen snail mail kind of on TikTok where a lot of illustrators and kind of more traditional artists were doing this and I thought well why not do that for photography I hadn't really seen photography ones around and it's become like the perfect antithesis to the Instagram doom scroll and it's been what's really nice is like people have responded really well to being able to have a physical print and actually spend more time looking at a photo rather than just seeing it on your feed and you know you glance at it and then you scroll and see another 300 images um so yeah it was kind of an anti-instagram doom scroll reaction and then presumably you've had
Iain:
lots of lovely folks reaching out not just me because I you know I knew you already we met on a photo walk and I I shared I think what you're doing when you started with in the newsletter yes
Artemis:
which I'm very grateful for.
Iain:
Oh, it's tremendous. I love doing it. But have you heard, what's the response been like now that it's been running for nearly six months?
Artemis:
It's been really lovely. One of the first messages I received from the first edition, it was such a nice message and so unexpected that I actually cried when I read it, like happy tears. The first edition was called The Fig Tree. And I guess another catalyst for doing this was turning 30 and just kind of feeling like previous years I'd not really taken much action and then I turned 30 and I was like I'm just going to do things I'm just going to start mailing out prints to people why not um and so this this woman who signed up said I am so glad I decided to go for it and signed up you were right it is so refreshing to slow down it gives me a different feeling or thought every time I hold your art print in my hand and I was just like that's so lovely like the thought that this print has arrived in someone's home and they're actually taking the time to look at it and read the words that I wrote to go with it is just it's everything I wanted from snail mail really and yeah it just it feels very affirming and lovely I can tell you that making the show it's the same feeling it's
Iain:
the best bit is hearing from folks right it's just it's just lovely because then that prompts a conversation about what they like to make and what you like to make and yeah it's it's I have a a note saved on my computer which every time someone contacts me about it I save it in there and I've spoken Craig Mod a previous guest has a similar thing he has a text file which is I think he called something like the you're not shit dot txt or something like that and it's just yeah everything someone nice someone says it's nice he puts in yes I actually have one
Artemis:
of those as well um I have a folder called um affirmations nice and I take a screenshot every time someone leaves like a nice comment or a nice message um and I I think it's a great practice it really helps I think anyone doing anything creative um you go through ups and downs and it really helps when you're in one of the downs to kind of remind yourself why you're doing what you're doing
Iain:
yeah I had a wobble at the beginning of the year and it looking back at that and I was putting some stuff together it does really help lift you out of the thing as does community I think we all need a group of people around us and hopefully what you're doing will inspire other people to make things and then they'll start doing things and it it has this kind of I like to call it kind of creative pachinko machine of just bouncing off stuff and we all have this this impact on each other. I think that's, it's a rather lovely thing. One thing I have to solve, and you might know the answer to this. I've started to collect these things. I'm not sure where to keep them. Has anyone contacted you with like a nice, smart way of storing them yet?
Artemis:
Not yet. I mean, I would love to hear from people more what they actually do with them. I know this lady has held the art print a few times, but I don't know where it's ended up. I actually signed up to someone else's snail mail. Gosh, her name has escaped me now, but she uses analog photos and she kind of cuts them into strips and kind of weaves them back together. And what I do with her prints is just put them in little thrifted frames and use them to kind of decorate the space. I know scrapbooking is also popular. Yeah, I guess there are many different ways to do it. Where have yours ended up so far? They're next to me.
Iain:
Well, they're out. They're sort of exposed to the air. I have a shelf where I put notebooks and things. And so they're alongside all my previously filled up notebooks, which often have little trinkets and things in them. But I think they're probably going to need their own book or folder or something. I'm going to have the same problem with negatives now as well. I'm going to have to, yeah, I already have this with Polaroids. Yeah, exactly. I have Polaroids, but you see, Polaroids are quite good because they have specific albums. They're all the same size. You buy a Polaroid album. The Polaroid goes in the album. It fits perfectly. Job done. Keeps it nice and neat and orderly. These, and the other one I get, the other note that I get regularly is from Richard Cook, who's a previous guest who lives in New York, who does these little pictures that he sends out periodically. And he started sending me those because he listened to the podcast. And it's a similar thing. I don't know what to do with Richard's letters either. Because like yours, each one is a letter with a print of some sort. And so, yeah, I need to find a folder, I think. A little folder or a box or something.
Artemis:
Maybe I need to start making some kind of snail mail Polaroid folder type thing to go with it.
Iain:
Oh, merch. That's the future branded snail mail merch. This is how your Etsy store starts.
Artemis:
Absolutely. I'm surprised I don't have one yet.
Iain:
I feel like I should do the same thing. I guess now that you're into it as well, a few months in, has it become easier to do? Are you a wait till the end of the month, like the 11th hour to write the thing? Or do you have to? Oh, okay. You're still working this out.
Artemis:
I wish I was... I've been trying to be more organized and yet somehow, inevitably, something always happens and I end up being last minute, like just before, like the day before sending it out. Like this last month's one, the letter was a bit shorter because I was flying to Cyprus the next day. My partner and I moved out of our flat and then moved to Cyprus like within the same week. So trying to do snail mail while that was going on was definitely a challenge. But I'm trying to be a bit more organized and get things done ahead of time. to save myself some stress well the way I do it with listeners totally inside baseball but it
Iain:
might work for you as well it is a spreadsheet with dates and it is just putting in the kind of and that that gives me that is a source of tremendous comfort knowing knowing that you've got and I have columns for whether I've recorded it whether it's then edited whether it's been uploaded ready to go and is scheduled and that way you see because you can take the boy out of project management but you can't take the project management boy and so basically that that is the thing that I look at when I get a bit scared what it can sometimes do and I will give you the kind of the the thing I've learned through that as well is that sometimes you get too far ahead and then what happens is like I've got episodes recorded out until May and that means that I can't respond to things that happen in the moment. So that's why I have these midweek episodes, you see, and then I can have a little chat with someone and then it feels timely. I'm not sure it makes that much difference to listeners, but it's a difference psychologically to me. And then it also means I haven't recorded everything in January and then don't speak to another soul until May. Yes. That would suck as well.
Artemis:
That would be tough. Yeah.
Iain:
So when you're kind of thinking about these ideas, though, and you're thinking about physical things to send around the world, have you put any creative constraints on it? Is it it's never going to be more than this, it's never going to be less than that and things like that.
Artemis:
More or less in terms of like word count or images?
Iain:
Well, yeah, or maybe you said it's always going to be one sheet of paper. Or I know that's only because some people, like when you're making a product, I've worked in product development, that you have limitations on size or weight. Or if we make it bigger than this, it'll cost more to ship. So I'm just curious as to whether you've applied that kind of mindset to your snail mail.
Artemis:
Yes. So postcard print, I think a postcard size is a good size. It's not too big. I can't actually remember the actual dimensions, but yes, the bigger the letter, the more the postage. And so postcard size was nice kind of accessible size for me to be able to send things to people and not just be operating at a loss um and it's also quite cute it's a quite nice size um and I think in terms of like putting it into a frame or displaying it it also doesn't take up too much space um I definitely also yeah one sheet of paper because I actually find the writing one of the hardest parts it takes me quite some time to get to a place where I'm happy with writing um which when you kind of complimented my writing that I was over the moon it's like oh thank god the the work is is paying off um but so yeah a sheet of a4 kind of writing is is a limitation I set myself and also the previous issue was the first one that wasn't an analog process um but in general I've kind of veered away from digital and towards more analog processes kind of the same reason for snail mail going for processes that are more tactile more real I feel like we're kind of entering a modern day kind of arts and crafts movement much like back then it was a response against the industrial revolution I feel like people are returning now to more handmade things as a response against the AI slop revolution. The first issue was the fig tree. And that was a photo I took using the Binstax, which is the Instax back for the Mamiya RB67, which a friend lent to me and I became obsessed. Absolutely obsessed. I love that thing. I've sadly had to return it to him now, but I need to get my own one day. Then the issue after that was domestic bliss, and that was printing, doing cyanotypes on tea bags, which was actually, I was submitting to some experimental photo festival. And so that took up my entire month, and then that ended up being that month's theme. Then the month after that was using a photo booth, an analog photo booth portrait, and mixing that with acrylic paints and kind of experimenting with that. And then the one after that was Tintypes, which I actually had the chance to shoot with my friend Willow, who taught themselves Tintypes over lockdown, which is absolutely insane to me. I wish I had a brain that worked like that. And then, yeah, the previous issue was a photo I took when I was living in Brazil. And that was slightly analog-ish in the sense that it was digital, but with a vintage lens. And that's what I used to shoot on for years. Because even when I was shooting digital, I still liked having that kind of just slightly more real, more tactile feeling that a vintage glass does more than kind of, you know, the new, very glossy. overly perfect you can see every single pore lenses that we have nowadays so yeah I think I've always loved analog processes and snail mail feels like a very kind of natural extension of
Iain:
that and we don't have anything physical in our lives anymore I think that's the other thing about this is that so many things in the world are smooth and have no rough edges have no they don't challenge us in any way they you know every if we're if we're doing it right every piece of software we interacted with is broadly doing what we wanted to do and is doing it quite efficiently and quickly you can order your groceries in seconds you can make things arrive you know like even sending even something like getting film processed where you used to have to go into a store where you just stick in an envelope it goes away and then a dropbox link comes back and just every part of our life we've removed as almost as much friction as it's possible to remove so when your letters arrive and they're sealed with wax and they're different colors and there's a there's a note I you know like your like your previous recipient was saying you you open it and it's got that lovely kind of you know I'll do a bit of pound land asmr but you know it's nice it's nice to feel paper it's nice to look at something and see what you've and stop for a moment and sit down with a cup of tea and just take a minute. And I think there is a reason we're craving that connection. I'm even missing old gadgets like iPods and things like that because you don't need multiple things anymore. One device that does everything and it's extremely convenient and it's a solved problem. We know what will phones look like in 20 years. Chances are, there's a good chance, they'll still be some sort of shaped thing. And maybe they'll fold and maybe they won't. And that'll be your choice. Do you want a foldy one or do you want a not foldy one? But it's going to be probably like laptops. We solved laptops in the 90s. And now we just have laptops. And so, yeah, I think stuff like what you're doing is great because it's the only opportunity that we have to be surprised in our day-to-day. You know, we cook the same seven meals each week mostly. You know, we go to the same places, we do the same stuff, we see the same people. So I love this. And I think everyone listening should invite some snail mail into their lives. Because as you say, for the serendipity of it.
Artemis:
Yeah, I mean, obviously, I agree. Everyone should have some snail mail. Yes. And yeah, I think, like you said, the elements of surprise, I think, is such a nice part of it. I know for me, receiving snail mail from other people as well. Yeah. not knowing what you're going to get in a world where, you know, everything is available instantly. Like you have to wait a month. You don't know what you're going to get. It's such a like nice kind of novel experience. And it's something to look forward to. Especially in the mail where you usually just get bills and takeaway leaflets.
Iain:
Yes. So many takeaway leaflets. No, it's lovely. So you're going to run this. This is an ongoing thing. if you put a time limit on it, or are you just intending to do this for as long as you can?
Artemis:
Very good question. I think I've kind of told myself I want to commit to a year at least. That feels like a good amount of time, a complete year. And then we'll see where it goes from there.
Iain:
Yeah. Don't burn yourself out. I think that's the thing. I think do it for as long as it's fun. And if it stops being fun, that's, you know.
Artemis:
Well, if I stop leaving it to the last minute, it will be even more fun.
Iain:
there will there will come a point where you'll just you'll be able to do it standing on your head and you'll just have the ideas have you do you read kind of you like quite broadly and creatively like other disciplines and things like that to feed your artistic kind of practice or how how do you kind of get your inspiration is it going to sound terrible if I say I don't really read much
Artemis:
um I guess so far it's mostly come from the constraint of I have to make something this month what am I going to make and sometimes it's been quite serendipitous like with the second issue where I was making this cyanotype on tea bag experiment anyway um and then I kind of I do want it to be kind of related to what I'm experiencing or going through each month so the next issue most likely um will be a photo from Cyprus which is where I am currently um visiting my dad uh we arrived the day of the drone strike so perfect timing yeah but um yeah so whatever's kind of going on in my life at that time kind of processing it through making an image and then sharing that I think is is currently what feels right to me and is also why kind of planning ahead maybe hasn't hasn't worked out so well at least that's what I tell myself not just because I'm
Iain:
disorganized planning ahead's overrated my friend thank you I agree yes yeah especially when we're fleet of foot, we're teams of one, we can do whatever we like. And that's, I think, you know,
Artemis:
that's an important thing. There's no rules, you know? Yeah, I guess it's that balance, right? Of like, we can do anything, but then we can't do everything. Yes. So having some kind of constraint, like the monthly constraint, or trying to be analog does help. Otherwise, I often feel quite overwhelmed with, if I can make anything, what do I make? Yes. I started a, this is semi-related, but I kind of serendipitously started a mini photo series, again, on the bin stacks where I just became obsessed with the color red. And so I'd set up a red backdrop, which was just a red bedsheet from Amazon draped over my TV. And I'd invite friends over to use a red object of some kind. And then we'd have one pack of Instax, so 10 shots, and that was it. And whatever we made was whatever we made. And that was such a, having those constraints, ironically, was really liberating. And it's probably one of my favorite projects ever.
Iain:
Would you ever exhibit stuff like that, do you think? Do you want to kind of pull together a common thread or a few little, like three or four disparate smaller projects and exhibit those?
Artemis:
I would love to, yeah. I was part of my first, second, I was part of a group exhibition a few months ago. And that was a really nice kind of, a really nice experience that kind of helped fuel me in terms of like, oh, actually you can just do things. You can just kind of get a group of people together and organize something. So it's, yeah, it's something I'd love to look into either while I'm out here in Cyprus or when I get back to London, who knows. But yeah, I'm kind of exhibiting more.
Iain:
it's something I definitely like to do especially if you're making physical things seems like seeing those in a space and things like that have you ever put together little books or things for your own
Artemis:
edification of work you know no not yet again it's it's that disorganization I've kind of started projects a bit but then a lot of my work has been kind of very free-flowing and not really had a kind of central theme so trying to kind of corral that into something that makes sense has been quite tricky although I've been looking kind of through my archives archives makes it sound like it's kind of more serious than it is um but photos from when I was living in Brazil um and actually looking back on them now I'm like actually that there's quite there's some nice stuff here um and I approached a cafe near where I was living in London to exhibit some of them so fingers crossed that that will work out a small showcase of of that work and actually to tie it back to snail mail one of those one of those photos was the last edition which was the grandfather's garden um which is my ex-husband's hands picking parsley I think it was from his granddad's garden um that was from my time in Brazil and that body of work yeah oh that's super cool I was thinking while you were talking as well like
Iain:
Cyprus especially because um we might be on the cusp of an exciting time who knows a collection of images from your time in Cyprus as well might be the kind of thing that you know is a collection and you know we should all think about our archive like the end of Indiana Jones like a big room filled with like potentially really cool stuff and you should go back and visit it like I don't think it's too grand to say it's an archive it definitely is you know this is this story of our lives and our friends are going to want to see that you know through our lives and when we're gone someone's going to want to look at it you know so I think it's not it's not too grand And, you know, to kind of say, oh, it's this like, yeah, you do the right thing. Like revisit that stuff, pull it out. And someone, it'll connect with people just like it did with that first person who let you know that they really cherished what you'd made and sent them.
Artemis:
Yeah. Yeah, that was that was so nice of her. Yeah.
Iain:
I have to say, I love your tintype. One thing we should mention your friend again in the tintypes, because I think when everyone's making banana bread, it does take a special kind of person to order nitrate off the Internet. But how was that experience?
Artemis:
because it is an extremely sharp photo it really is good thank you I'm so happy with how it turned out I think I mentioned in the letter I can't remember exactly what willow was using but I think they had a large format camera from that place in Brighton I can't remember the name of and some kind of like prism round glass thing that they were holding in front of the the camera to be the lens um I can't remember the reasoning but I was quite skeptical I was like I've never used this before I don't know how this is going to come out and somehow it's like probably the crispest photo I've ever taken in my life um yeah I I met willow through tiktok back in I think 2021 something like that um and we just became friends and then I went down to Brighton they showed me every step of the process and took a portrait of me to kind of show me the process and then let me take one and it was it was so much fun I would I would love to do it again I think Willow hasn't really been active on Instagram I think last I saw they were playing the banjo somewhere in America of course new side quest yep yep I feel like the tintype to banjo pipeline is is quite a common one I really wish I had a but this is the one time in making the show
Iain:
that I've wished is visual because having a visual and animation for tintype to banjo pipeline like that needs to be on a slide somewhere in a marketing agency
Artemis:
that's so good um but yeah at the time they had a kind of home studio set up um and I always said to them like you should you should do workshops you should kind of do more of this because people people love tin types and it's very hard to find in in the uk at least in my experience there are very few people who who do it it seems to be a much bigger thing in in America um but yeah hopefully we'll we'll come back to it and host workshops um mainly so I can do the workshops and take four tintypes I like the idea of your friend returning like a soldier from war
Iain:
and going I'm going to teach you all how to do tintypes let's go um Nitrate Fox was a guest on the show previously I don't know if you listened to that episode she's rad she does tintype wet well wet plate stuff with um she's done a big project on roller derby players oh and travel amazing oh it is amazing traveled the length and breadth of the u.s to find roller derby players because she plays roller derby and she made a book uh named after the term for when people get pretty like get a hard hit in roller derby and they fall over and they you know to help them up and you can be a bit confused they call it Jamnesia and that is the name of the book and it's superb and she's one of the real ones go and look up the episode's great yeah she's really good I'll send you a link afterwards she's a great guest and yeah her story her commitment to that art form should be inspiration to Willow once they've finished being in a band yes
Artemis:
I will be sending this episode to them
Iain:
as motivation
Artemis:
come back Willow
Iain:
yeah come back always forgiven tintype needs you there's not that many there's not that many people doing it it's like the the you know Parks and Rec or whatever it's like there's dozens of us um well lovely to see your face and to hear from you and know that you're safe and sound in Cyprus um for people listening who haven't yet signed up to snail mail where can they go and sign up to snail mail they can go to
Artemis:
either my instagram bio or directly to my website uh which is artemisawakening.com slash shop if you want to go straight for the snail mail and all the info is there you can sign up you can cancel anytime, no pressure and there are also back issues on there if you do want to complete the collection, have every issue
Iain:
Splendid, well I encourage everyone to go and I will put this out obviously in a newsletter as well but lovely that you see you again Artemis have an amazing time with folks in Cyprus and yeah hopefully I'll run into you at a workshop or something down south when you're back.
Artemis:
Yes, that would be wonderful. Thank you for having me.
More about this show:
A camera is just a tool but spend enough time with photographers and you’ll see them go misty eyed when they talk about their first camera or a small fast prime that they had in their youth. Prime Lenses is a series of interviews with photographers talking about their photography by way of three lenses that mean a lot to them. These can be interchangeable, attached to a camera, integrated into a gadget, I’m interested in the sometimes complex relationship we have with the tools we choose, why they can mean so much and how they make us feel.